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(Message started by: yanny on Apr 9th, 2015, 11:18pm)

Title: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by yanny on Apr 9th, 2015, 11:18pm
http://i60.tinypic.com/m91yu0.jpg


it was there before all these takeaways appeared and even before the zebra crossing appeared outside the school.....

...another sign of the times. :-(

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Toby on Apr 10th, 2015, 11:51am
Perhaps it's being refurbished yanny  :D

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Pompadour on Apr 10th, 2015, 7:48pm
Your joking 8)

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Toby on Apr 10th, 2015, 9:13pm
You never know,dust off the bricks,stick 'em all back together and bob's yer uncle.
It's only a giant Lego set after all.

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Pompadour on Apr 11th, 2015, 8:42am

on 04/10/15 at 21:13:39, Toby wrote:
You never know,dust off the bricks,stick 'em all back together and bob's yer uncle.
It's only a giant Lego set after all.


Rebuild them all down the same road. WOW [smiley:beerbuds]

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Scribbles on Apr 11th, 2015, 2:46pm

on 04/10/15 at 21:13:39, Toby wrote:
.........bob's yer uncle.
It's only a giant Lego set after all.


You're referring to Bob Salisbury, landlord in the 1970s?  No, he's not my uncle.  Not even related although our children were friends at primary school.

It is very strange, seeing a wide open space where the Joker used to be.  Mr Scribbles tells me he's read that the space will soon be occupied by yet another apartment block  :o - oh, well - it's handy for the station, I suppose but I can't think of any other good reason for living there!

My one abiding memory of the Joker is of being locked in the Ladies' loo at closing time one winter night.  I was about 8 months pregnant and needed to 'go' quite frequently.  Mr Scribbles and I were ready to leave when I decided to pay a quick visit on my way out.  The Ladies' was very close to the street door, so Mr Scribbles said he'd wait outside.  Bert O'Connor, the barman, had been in charge that night and must have got rid of all the other punters very quickly because, while I was still in the cubicle, I heard the sound of a key being turned in the door back to the bar!!  By the time I got out into the basin area, the lights were out and everything was silent.  Help!!!!  I banged on the door and hollered but there was no response.  I feared that, if Bert had left via the rear door and Mr Scribbles had got cold waiting and walked off, I might be there all night.  This was  the seventies, long before we all had mobile phones so, apart from making a noise, there wasn't much I could do.  After all this time, I can't recall whether Bert heard me and let me out or whether Mr Scribbles intercepted Bert and demanded my release.  I know I was utterly panic-stricken and practically incoherent when a very red-faced and apologetic Bert unlocked the door. [smilie:sorry]  In all honesty, I don't think I was locked in for very long but I'm claustrophobic so it felt like an anxious eternity ....

Happy days!  To this day, I don't go in pub loos or any others at closing time without someone knowing I'm there and able to raise the alarm if necessary. [smilie:worried]

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Toby on Apr 11th, 2015, 8:50pm
Scribbles,your convenience was very inconvenient!

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Toby on Apr 11th, 2015, 9:28pm
Was The Joker known by any other name?
It was certainly not on our pub crawl list in the 60's althogh the near neighbour The Cauliflower was.

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Pompadour on Apr 12th, 2015, 3:27pm
If your gonna get locked in Scribbs, what better place than a pub. [smilie:drink]

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Scribbles on Apr 13th, 2015, 3:24pm
Yebbut, Pompey, the door between me and the happy juice was locked!!! :(

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Toby on Apr 13th, 2015, 5:17pm
You had a wee problem,was it a big job to get out? :-/

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Pompadour on Apr 14th, 2015, 8:35am

on 04/13/15 at 17:17:57, Toby wrote:
You had a wee problem,was it a big job to get out? :-/

Blimey Tobes, you could raise a bit of a stink with this one. ::)

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Toby on Apr 14th, 2015, 10:51am
I wish I had better things to do than think up this carp  :)


Blooming censor,spoilt my line.

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by ktype on Apr 14th, 2015, 12:45pm

on 04/11/15 at 21:28:32, Toby wrote:
Was The Joker known by any other name?
It was certainly not on our pub crawl list in the 60's althogh the near neighbour The Cauliflower was.

No but it depends when in the 60s, possibly.

I've only known it since 1973/4 but from conversations with established regulars I was led to believe that it wasn't very old.

I knew it was coming down but not as quickly as did!

It was a bit of a shock seeing just a JCB perched on a pile of rubble peeking over the top of the hoarding!

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Jamlamont on Apr 14th, 2015, 9:02pm
Flipping 'eck, Yanny (or words to that effect)!

I can't believe it is gone after all these years. My grandad used to drink in there and then sit on the bench on the little island opposite - facing Sainsbury's that was.

I also used to go in there for my lunch when I was working in the area - they did a good ham, egg and chips!

More flaming flats! There's no end to flats in this life....I am depressed!

 :-[

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Jamlamont on Apr 14th, 2015, 9:04pm
................and, there was nothing like stumbling out of Canon Palmer's and seeing the pub round the corner for consistency!

I am sooooooooo depressed!!

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by ktype on Apr 15th, 2015, 11:40am
I've been having further thoughts on the age of the Joker.

Anybody remember it before the Saloon and Lounge bars were knocked into one in the mid/late 70s?

There was a short corridor that ran from the right hand entrance to the Lounge at the back with the loos on the right hand side.

On the left was the entrance to the Saloon with the remainder being occupied by a partition consisting of glass panels set into some chunky black wood framing. Some of these panels featured beautiful engravings - and it is they that offer the best dating possibilities.

I have a feeling that there were six but can only recall four:
- The Jodrell Bank Radio Telescope (now known as the Lovell Telescope) which first entered service in mid 1957, just in time for the launch of
- Sputnik 1 in October 1957
- THETA. This was a machine to investigate nuclear fusion at the Atomic Research Centre at Harwell and was the successor to ZETA - Zero-Energy Toroidal (or Thermonuclear) Assembly - which also entered service in Summer 1957. However, I can't find any data to date it more accurately although there is still a Theta Engineering company based at Harwell!
- Last, but not least, SRN1 - the first practical hovercraft - which first flew in June 1959

Because of the publicity that surrounded them, images of these advances would have been instantly recognisable at the time. Their inclusion in the pub's design would point to the early 60s.

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Toby on Apr 15th, 2015, 3:42pm
I'm only guessing then that in the swinging 60's it was more of a local , attractions being arrowroot biscuits,pickled eggs and Castellas,manikins if you were short.(PUN)

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by yanny on Apr 15th, 2015, 3:59pm

on 04/14/15 at 21:04:44, Jamlamont wrote:
................and, there was nothing like stumbling out of Canon Palmer's and seeing the pub round the corner for consistency!

I am sooooooooo depressed!!


after my last gcse exam... I went into the joker for a drink..... changed out of my school uniform first...  
[smilie:raise_eyebrow]

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by yanny on Apr 15th, 2015, 4:04pm
supposedly a hotel is gonna be built there...........

http://www.ilfordrecorder.co.uk/news/the_joker_pub_in_seven_kings_closes_doors_as_developers_prepare_to_knock_it_down_1_3950893

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Toby on Apr 15th, 2015, 4:18pm
I'll wager that after a few months it will be full of DHSS claimants.

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Scribbles on Apr 15th, 2015, 7:21pm

Quote:
from the Recorder ...
....the new development would have a coffee shop and bar on the ground floor, open to the community.
“Obviously it’s not going to be as large as the Joker but we will have a bar so the locals have got somewhere to come back to.”

Hmm. And by the time the place is up and running, the Joker's former patrons will have discovered where to catch the bus to JD Wetherspoon's local branches and may well never return.


Quote:
You had a wee problem,was it a big job to get out?

No, Tobes - merely a tiddly inconvenience and I soon washed my hands of it!

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Toby on Apr 15th, 2015, 8:05pm
Ho,Ho scribbles,good riposte. ;-D

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by ktype on Apr 16th, 2015, 11:09am
Oh dear! A bit too late for the Joker ...

"The latest changes to permitted development rights came into force this week. One of the changes now states that pubs that are listed as Assets of Community Value (England only) now require planning permission to be demolished or changed to any other use. In effect existing permitted development rights will be removed for pubs listed as ACVs for as long as the pub is on the local authorities Assets of Community Value list. This is another success in the civic movement's campaign to see even more community buildings across the country listed as ACVs. We would urge you all to now start nominating your pubs as ACVs to give them more local protection."

From the 'Civic Voice' newsletter as reported on the Barkingside 21 blog. (http://barkingside21.blogspot.co.uk/2015/04/assets-of-community-value-pubs-high.html)

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Pompadour on Apr 16th, 2015, 4:26pm

on 04/15/15 at 19:21:18, Scribbles wrote:
Hmm. And by the time the place is up and running, the Joker's former patrons will have discovered where to catch the bus to JD Wetherspoon's local branches and may well never return.

No, Tobes - merely a tiddly inconvenience and I soon washed my hands of it!

I bet you were a bit flushed after that scribbs. ;-D

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Jamlamont on Apr 16th, 2015, 8:56pm

on 04/15/15 at 11:40:08, ktype wrote:
I've been having further thoughts on the age of the Joker.

Anybody remember it before the Saloon and Lounge bars were knocked into one in the mid/late 70s?

There was a short corridor that ran from the right hand entrance to the Lounge at the back with the loos on the right hand side.

On the left was the entrance to the Saloon with the remainder being occupied by a partition consisting of glass panels set into some chunky black wood framing. Some of these panels featured beautiful engravings - and it is they that offer the best dating possibilities.

I have a feeling that there were six but can only recall four:
- The Jodrell Bank Radio Telescope (now known as the Lovell Telescope) which first entered service in mid 1957, just in time for the launch of
- Sputnik 1 in October 1957
- THETA. This was a machine to investigate nuclear fusion at the Atomic Research Centre at Harwell and was the successor to ZETA - Zero-Energy Toroidal (or Thermonuclear) Assembly - which also entered service in Summer 1957. However, I can't find any data to date it more accurately although there is still a Theta Engineering company based at Harwell!
- Last, but not least, SRN1 - the first practical hovercraft - which first flew in June 1959

Because of the publicity that surrounded them, images of these advances would have been instantly recognisable at the time. Their inclusion in the pub's design would point to the early 60s.


Oh yes, K-type - I remember it long before it was "knocked into one" - in fact, I didn't even know it had been because I was gone by then!

My dear old Grandad was a drinker in there in the early 60's when I was only a baby - but I have the photographs!

I lunched there in approx. 1974/5 and it was still two bars then.

Then I had a series of Irish boyfriends who all frequented the public only side of the bar. The majority lived in Elgin Road as I recall. I, personally, was raised in Norfolk Road.  

Then, change came into my life, and I left Ilford for Hornchurch and subsequently Barking (*retch* - that didn't last long, thankfully) and then elsewhere.

However, some of my happiest memories are of that time.

I also particularly remember attending a Silver Jubilee Party in Buckingham Road, Ilford in 1977 when I was a tender young thing who yet had much to learn.

Happy Days!          ;-D

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by ktype on Apr 17th, 2015, 2:52pm

on 04/16/15 at 20:56:54, Jamlamont wrote:
... I lunched there in approx. 1974/5 and it was still two bars then ...

Actually it had three bars then! The small Public Bar accessed via the doors at the left hand side and the Saloon and Lounge Bars accessed via the right hand entrance.

When I first went there in 1974, the Public and Saloon Bar clientèle were predominantly Irish wheras the Lounge Bar catered for a mixture of commuters and more established residents - apart from the manager and assistant manager, who were both Irish, I don't think I ever heard another Irish accent in there!

The entire pub got very busy in the evenings, although the Lounge Bar didn't fill up until later on but the quantities of spirits with profit making mixers would, I would think, amply compensate for the later start!

About 1977 the management changed and then about a year later, Courage decided to knock the place apart. The screen, corridor and Lounge Bar entrance disappeared with the street entrance now opening out directly into the newly extended Saloon.

Courage decided that they were going to make a lot of money from selling food, particularly at lunch time. A length of the bar was cut away and converted into a drop down cold cabinet for lunch time use, folding up to form the bar again in the evening. Much of the seating in the former Lounge was replaced by an ugly 'Y' shaped construction in the middle with a narrow shelf running round it. The new influx of lunchtime eaters would be eating standing up, decided Courage!

In the event, it wasn't a success. Although I never went there at lunchtime, the 'Y' shaped thing was stuck out in the car park after a short time and the cold shelf was obviously just being used for sundry storage.

The Saloon Bar customers expanded into the new space and the traditional Lounge Bar customers, in the main, voted with their wallets.

A bad move by Courage because the former assistant manager and two partners were in the process of re-opening the former cinema/bingo hall directly opposite as The Shannon Centre, which promptly siphoned off much of the Irish trade!

It was not until after the brewers were forced to get rid of their large pub estates that the new owners finally demolished the interior wall on either side of the fireplace and made the final move to a one bar pub.

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Jamlamont on Apr 19th, 2015, 9:45pm
Gosh, K-type - that means you coulda been in there the same time as me and we didn't even know each other then...! Well, we don't know each other now except in a virtual sense but you know what I mean!

;-D

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Scribbles on Apr 20th, 2015, 6:03pm

Quote:
Gosh, K-type - that means you coulda been in there the same time as me and we didn't even know each other then...!


This is eerie ... I also started going to the Joker in 1974, when I first moved to this area.  To think ... we could've all been queueing at the bar at the same time.

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Pompadour on Apr 21st, 2015, 9:06am

on 04/20/15 at 18:03:55, Scribbles wrote:
This is eerie ... I also started going to the Joker in 1974, when I first moved to this area.  To think ... we could've all been queueing at the bar at the same time.

Blimey, spooky or what, it only wants Yanno to pipe up and say he was the barman at that time to crown it. [smilie:scared]

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by ktype on Apr 26th, 2015, 9:32pm

on 04/17/15 at 14:52:20, ktype wrote:
... A bad move by Courage because the former assistant manager and two partners were in the process of re-opening the former cinema/bingo hall directly opposite as The Shannon Centre, which promptly siphoned off much of the Irish trade!

And guess which is the next building in Seven Kings (http://planning.redbridge.gov.uk/swiftlg/apas/run/WPHAPPDETAIL.DisplayUrl?theApnID=0951/13&backURL=%3Ca%20href=wphappcriteria.display%3ESearch%20Criteria%3C/a%3E%20%3E%20%3Ca%20href=%27wphappsearchres.displayResultsURL?ResultID=37279796%26StartIndex=21%26SortOrder=rgndat:desc%26DispResultsAs=wphappsresweek1%26BackURL=%3Ca%20href=wphappcriteria.display%3ESearch%20Criteria%3C/a%3E%27%3ESearch%20Results%3C/a%3E) facing demolition and redevelopment ...?

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Scribbles on Apr 27th, 2015, 1:02pm
I'm not a frequenter of night clubs  so I can't speak from first hand experience but I've heard nothing good about the place for several years so it probably won't be too badly missed - except by the chavs who'll have to find somewhere else to fight on a Friday night  ::)

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by ktype on Apr 27th, 2015, 7:49pm
The Shannon Centre has changed beyond all recognition in recent years. As far as I know, when the three directors retired, the place was sold to chain of clubs and, as far as I can see, any pretence of being Irish disappeared long ago.

It is now divided into (at least) two separate businesses now but as I haven't been inside it now for more years than I care to remember - certainly the best part of 30 -  don't know any more than that.

Another Irish pub (http://www.ogradysirishbar.com/) opened up further along the High Road at about the time the Shannon was sold - I'm told it was opened by the previous bar manager at the Shannon - and has become extremely popular.

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by yanny on Apr 28th, 2015, 7:56pm
o'gradys......when ive been up to Ilford, I always pop in their,.....great pub, its more than just a pub now. :)

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by yanny on May 4th, 2015, 10:04am
im heading up to Ilford today so ill take some up to date photos of what it looks like now

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by piper1x on Aug 21st, 2015, 12:51am
I worked in the Joker when I first arrived in London as a young 18 year old student in July 1970. I liked it so much I stayed until 1973. At that time there was the public bar (where I generally served), saloon bar and lounge. The governor then was a man called Jack...can't remember his second name who was never in the bar and his very elegant wife who really managed the place. Then Jim Reagan took over. It was always very busy at weekends. I made so many friends there and I am sure I probably served some of the subscribers here. Got some dates also. I have not been there since I left in 1973. What a shame it is gone.

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by ktype on Aug 27th, 2015, 10:55pm

on 08/21/15 at 00:51:03, piper1x wrote:
... I liked it so much I stayed until 1973 ... I made so many friends there and I am sure I probably served some of the subscribers here ...

I first drank in the Joker in December 1973, so we probably just missed each other ...

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by yanny on Sep 3rd, 2015, 9:16pm
I was up in seven kings last weekend and they have put white barriers up.... not much progress yet....

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by ktype on Sep 6th, 2015, 7:18pm
The white barriers have been there for over four months, replacing the original temporary barriers.

As for progress, you can't see through them so you've no idea of what is (or isn't) going on. If the barriers stay as they are, nobody is going to see anything until the new building reaches first floor level ...

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by yanny on Oct 9th, 2015, 3:53pm
unless you borrow a chair from the chip shop just next door and peek over..............   ;-D

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Pompadour on Oct 9th, 2015, 7:57pm
Just be careful how you plaice the chair yanno. ;-D

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Selena on Jan 22nd, 2016, 3:42pm
Think they having a little issue with planning as it was a hotel and flats they wanted to build after they found the cannabis den in the cellar of the Joker. Also the local brothel next door has complained about loss of trade. The Shannon centre had a murder which is never good for business but you will be glad to hear the Cauliflour has been re-opened as music venue.

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by yanny on Jan 25th, 2016, 9:32am
brothel...... whereabouts ?  [smilie:raise_eyebrow] [smilie:rofl]

....at least its good news about the cauliflower.  [smilie:thumbsup]

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by ktype on Feb 12th, 2017, 8:59pm
Well, those barriers are still there 18 months on but there are now signs of progress.

I couldn't work out what was taking so long after demolishing the pub to get back up to ground level but I think I now know the answer - it isn't just the pub site which is being developed but the whole area behind the shops which presumably took a lot of work building the extended foundations.

The building frame has now shot up - I don't know exactly when it first put in an appearance over the barriers - but it looks to be about three storeys high at present. However, I was just driving past and didn't have time to take in more than a brief glance of it.

I got the impression that the front elevation has been swung round slightly in a clockwise direction but this could be an illusion created by the barriers not necessarily being parallel to the old frontage and also that the new one is curved, not straight.

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by ktype on Mar 5th, 2017, 6:05pm
Noticed the other day that the old Shannon site is surrounded by scaffolding and looks as if it is being demolished.

More flats, possibly? After all, it is right opposite the new Crossrail station - or the Elizabeth line as it will now be known - so very convenient for some the new commuters who are expected to flood into the area (as will be the new much extended Joker development).

Bearing in mind that it was originally a cinema, the Shannon site site goes back a long way from the road ...

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by ktype on Jun 6th, 2017, 7:13pm
That was the Joker, that was ...

http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii16/ktype_photo/forum/Joker01.jpg

http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii16/ktype_photo/forum/Joker02.jpg

... and this was the Shannon Centre ...

http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii16/ktype_photo/forum/Shannon02.jpg

View down Farley drive showing the depth of the site.

http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii16/ktype_photo/forum/Shannon01.jpg

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by yanny on Jul 14th, 2017, 4:01pm
cant see any photos ktype..................

...pretty quiet on here recently.  :(

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by Scribbles on Jul 17th, 2017, 7:18pm
Yeh, this is greedy Photobucket who now want to charge you for 3rd party links.
I've voted with my wallet and now use one of the services below. Ktype might like to try re-posting his pics.
Good to see you, Yanny. Although no longer in Ilford, I still glance in here from time to time but thought I was the only one!


https://imgbb.com or www.tinypic.com

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by yanny on Sep 20th, 2017, 7:40pm

on 07/17/17 at 19:18:24, Scribbles wrote:
but thought I was the only one!


https://imgbb.com or www.tinypic.com


....never!!!, remember all those guests,could be anyone...


... ::) ::) ::)

.....nigel... smileys arent appearing

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by yanny on Sep 23rd, 2017, 10:17am
.....any community spirit left in redbridge/ilford?

Title: Re: The joker pub, seven kings   ITS GONE!
Post by ktype on Dec 31st, 2018, 7:20pm
Just thought I'd take look at progress, although the closest I could get was last March. Not much happening on the Shannon site, by the looks of things but I've pulled this view back a bit to show what Creed's looks like now (it had been gone for a while when I took the previous pictures but forgot to include it)

http://https://goo.gl/maps/b2CZGTVtjX12

or

https://goo.gl/maps/b2CZGTVtjX12

and here's the Joker:

http://https://goo.gl/maps/QWfZHCkJma62

or

https://goo.gl/maps/QWfZHCkJma62

(For some unknown reason, the image links aren't working as they should do!)



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